Gebruikerbespreking:Dutchy45

Hallo Dutchy45, hartelik welkom op die Afrikaanse Wikipedia! Dankie vir jou belangstelling in Wikipedia. Ons werk hier aan die ideaal van ’n gratis en vrylik beskikbare, vrylik bewerkbare, neutrale en volledige ensiklopedie. Die Afrikaanse Wikipedia bestaan al sedert Desember 2001 en bevat reeds 115 768 artikels. Vanaf die begin van die projek het die gebruikers ’n aantal riglyne en uitgangspunte vir artikelbewerking en onderlinge samewerking opgestel. Nuwelinge kan hieruit voordeel trek. Jy mag dit behulpsaam vind om van die skakels in hierdie raampie te volg en met die projek vertroud te raak voordat jy begin bydra. Indien jou vingers jeuk om te eksperimenteer, kan jy gerus ons Sandput besoek: dit is juis vir die rede daar. Uiteindelik wil ons dat al ons gebruikers vry voel om hulle gang te gaan, maar dit doen natuurlik geen kwaad om ’n bietjie houvas te kry voor 'n mens in die diep kant in spring nie! Besoek gerus ook ons Geselshoekie, ons gebruikers staan gereed om hand by te sit, of bloot net hand te skud. ___ Verifieerbaarheid Die eerste van Wikipedia se drie kernbeleide ___ Geselshoekie Die gewilde bymekaarkomplek ___ Geen oorspronklike navorsing Die tweede van Wikipedia se drie kernbeleide ___ Sandput Eksperimenteer na hartelus ___ Neutrale standpunt Die derde van Wikipedia se drie kernbeleide ___ Redigeringsinstruksies Hoe maak ek: teks wat skuinsgedruk is? ’n opskrif? tabelle? ___ Wat Wikipedia nie is nie Daar is ook ’n paar dinge wat ons nié hier doen nie ___ Beelde As jy jou kiekies wil oplaai ___ Beleefdheid Ken jou maniere ___ Wenke vir die skryf van ’n goeie artikel Soms sê die naam alles Hierdie bladsy, wat nou op jou skerm staan, is trouens jou persoonlike besprekingsbladsy. Die plek waar ander Wikipediane jou in die toekoms kan kontak en jy hulle dan kan beantwoord. Elke gebruiker het so ’n bladsy. Jy kan dus ook boodskappe op ander gebruikers se besprekingsbladsye los. Sluit boodskappe en besprekings altyd af met ~~~~ of deur op die handtekeningknop in die wysigingsvenster te kliek: sodoende word jou boodskap onderteken met jou gebruikersnaam en die datum en tyd waarop die boodskap voltooi is. Kliek dan as laaste op "Stoor bladsy" om enige bewerkings te stoor.

--KabouterBot (kontak) 09:51, 27 Januarie 2018 (UTC)

Your changes are wrong

@Dutchy45:, can you please reverse al these default sort changes that you have made as they are wrong. The Afrikaans grammer rules differ from Nederlands and Flemish. It is urgent. Oesjaar (kontak) 05:18, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Hello @Oesjaar,
African grammar rules do not apply here since we are talking about Dutch people. I've had this exact same conversation on other Wikimedia language projects. As you can see here in the 2nd paragraph and here, the English language WP knows this and has devoted space to exactly how Dutch names should be alphabaticed. Ofcourse I understand that the Afrikaans WP has not since it's a lot smaller. A lot of Dutch names with prepositions on the Afrikaans WP were already correctly alphabaticed so there are editors active who already knew this. I am just correcting the ones that were not.
Regards, Dutchy45 (kontak) 05:46, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Editing to add that I will not continue defaultsorting till this is resolved/you are satisfied. Dutchy45 (kontak) 06:16, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

I appreciate that. I have referred this to an Afrikaans/Nederlands specialist and will get back to you once I have an answer. For the record, your use of the word African is wrong, we are Afrikaans and there is a huge difference as Afrikaans have nothing in common with African languages except for a couple of borrowed words. We can only relate to the Nederlands and Flemish langauges. We are indeed in a interesting situation down here in Africa. My one dream still is to build a better relationship with the Flemish/Nederlands Wikipedia communities. Groete. Oesjaar (kontak) 06:28, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Ah yes, I already know that (the African/Afrikaans thing). One can't live for over a year in SA without figuring that out. No rush with an answer. Let's get this right while not watching the clock. 1 more thing about this that I've thought of: I got these names from categories of Dutch people. I did not check if some of them had become South-African after immigrating. They might have been categorised wrong. Or there might be some dual nationality thing going on. And I have no idea what the rules are then.
Groete, Dutchy45 (kontak) 07:01, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Ek kan my nie uitlaat oor wat die regte manier is nie, maar die HAT se Taal- en Feitegids gebruik die vorm "Van Gogh, Theo" en "Van Rensburg, Brümilda". ~ Burgert (kontak) 08:20, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Greetings @Burgert Behr FYI,
The issue is not about Brümilda van Rensburg. She is South-African and the discussion Oesjaar and I have been having is about correctly categorising Dutch people's names. I don't know the language guide book you're referencing but I actually don't believe it matters. IMO, this is about how WP sorts Dutch people's names, not how different languages sort those names. With respect to Taalfoendi (I've looked at her userpage and she very much seems like a expert), I don't believe she can be off much help here. I am curious about what she has to say though. So I'm pinging her here @Taalfoendi:
Regards, Dutchy45 (kontak) 12:13, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

If you continue with this attitude this discussion is over. Oesjaar (kontak) 12:21, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

@Oesjaar, I really have no idea what you are talking about. I can assure you that it wasn't my intention to offend either you, Burgert Behr or anybody else in this discussion. If I inadvertently did so I apologise! Dutchy45 (kontak) 15:53, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Ek kon via Gebruiker:Taalfoendi met prof. Nerina Bosman van UP daaroor praat. Nou moet ons net wag... Groete! Oesjaar (kontak) 09:13, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Good afternoon, everyone

I have talked to prof. Bosman and, interestingly enough, this was also a heated debate under the editors of the journal Internationale Neerlandistiek. After consideration these editors decided that ONE convention would be followed and, again interestingly enough, they chose the Afrikaans convention. Thus, prof. Bosman and I both agree that the Afrikaans way of sorting the surnames should be the convention on Afrikaanse Wikipedia. Kind regards! Taalfoendi (kontak) 15:01, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Thank you Taalfoendi. @Dutchy45: this was an interesting exercise. We have been fair, can you kindly please reverse your changes now. Groete! Oesjaar (kontak) 17:12, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

@Oesjaar, I think most have already been reverted. But I'll have a look in my contributions to make sure. Dutchy45 (kontak) 15:53, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Ek het op VivA se Taalwerkersforum gevra, en die antwoord is eenparig - "Van Rensburg, Brümilda", ens. En Dutchy45, dit gaan oor eenvormigheid, dus hoe dit in Afrikaans geskryf word, nie uit watter taal die van kom nie. ~ Burgert (kontak) 20:55, 25 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

@Burgert Behr, (sorry for writing in English, I hope yours is good enough to understand.) There's little point in repeating myself, especially since this discussion is now over, but if that were true the English WP wouldn't have this. Click here.

Moet ons ook die Afrikaanse kapitalisering van vanne met "van" en "de" vir nie-Afrikaanssprekendes gebruik? Sien bv. Kategorie:Belgiese boogskutters. Van die vanne begin met hoofletters, wat vreemd vir 'n Afrikaanssprekende leser sal lyk, al is dit moontlik korrek in Vlaams of Nederlands. – K175 (skil 'n appeltjie) 12:00, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Ja ons moet want dit is die Afrikaanse manier. Hierdie klompie lyk reg behalwe dat sommige kleinletters en ander hoofletters is. Groete. Oesjaar (kontak) 12:52, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Dankie Gebruiker:Oesjaar. @Burgert Behr, Taalfoendi, JMK, en Suidpunt: stem julle saam? – K175 (skil 'n appeltjie) 12:57, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Kleinletters. ~ Burgert (kontak) 13:23, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Hallo daar! Ek het 10 van die Belgiese boogskutters solank omgeskakel.  Aliwal2012 13:31, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

@Burgert Behr, Taalfoendi, JMK, Suidpunt, Oesjaar, en Aliwal2012: I am not sure if I understand the previous few replies since they were in Afrikaans, so to be certain I'll point out that prepositions (words like "van" in surnames), are capitalised in Belgium but not in the Netherlands. Dutchy45 (kontak) 15:53, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Neither in Afrikaans, unless there are no names or intitials in front of them. "Sy naam is Piet du Toit", but "Sy van is Du Toit". ~ Burgert (kontak) 16:28, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)

Yep, same in the Netherlands. Dutchy45 (kontak) 16:33, 26 Augustus 2023 (UTC)